PODCAST: Crushing Cold Reachout With Guillaume Moubeche

By Itamar Shafir on Dec 10, 2021

In Episode 30 of the Marketing Umbrella Podcast, Umbrella CEO Itamar Shafir interviews Guillaume Moubeche (known as “G”), cofounder and CEO of lemlist.

Lemlist helps businesses and digital marketing agencies create effective and personalized cold emailing campaigns.

G is an email and social marketing master who excels at helping SaaS businesses and implementing B2B growth strategies.

Find out about

  • How G started lemlist with $1,000 and became a $10m company within 3 years.
  • What personalization is, what it isn’t, and how to employ it to your emails successfully.
  • The factors that play into whether an email reaches an inbox and whether it gets read
  • The structure of an effective cold email and effective cold email campaign
  • More!

Read on for the transcript. You can also:

Listen to the podcast  or Watch the video

TRANSCRIPT

Welcome to episode 30 of The Marketing Umbrella with Itamar Shafir. This week Itamar sits down with Guillaume Moubeche and they discuss his company lemlist, how they help people create effective and personalized cold emailing campaigns and Guillaume’s thoughts on the structure of effective cold emails and cold email campaigns.

 

 

 

Itamar Shafir:

Welcome to The Marketing Umbrella Podcast, where we talk with successful marketing experts about ways to build and grow a digital marketing agency. Our guest today is an email and social marketing master. He’s a successful entrepreneur who took his company to 10 million dollars ARR, completely bootstrapped. And while exiting on a side project, we’re going to talk about that as well, he says he’s on a mission to help one million entrepreneurs build a profitable business by 2025. I’m excited to say hello to CEO of Lemlist, Mr. Guillaume Moubeche. Hi Guillaume.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Hey, Itamar. Really happy to be here.

Itamar Shafir:

And I’m happy to have you. As I told you before the podcast, I’m also a Lemlister, and used it. So I’m excited to talk about it. But before we jump into how we help the listeners crush cold emailing or email related to sales, maybe you can tell us a little bit about your journey, how you got started to basically starting up Lemlist, and your journey until that.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Yeah, definitely. So initially I’m actually a chemical engineer. So I have a master in chemical engineering, which has nothing to do with what I’m doing right now. And my parents, they grew up on the farm. Didn’t study a lot. So for them, it was super important for me to study science so I could get a good degree, a good job and a good situation later on. And after that, I always was passionate by business and marketing. So once I got my master, I just decided to keep studying and do another master in marketing. And this is where I was like, “Okay, I want to become an entrepreneur.” So I launched a business with my dad. It was a t-shirt business. Total failure, didn’t work out at all, but I realized how important it was to understand how to acquire customers at that time.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So I had a friend who started his own agency and he told me, “I’m basically doing sales prospecting for other companies to help them find customers. Do you want to start this company with me?” And I was like, “Okay, let’s do this. I know nothing, but we’ll learn.” And I started to run a lot of cold emailing campaigns. So we were basically finding the emails for our clients, then running their campaigns and booking meeting for them. And after sometimes, after generating hundreds of meetings for various companies a bit worldwide, I thought, okay, all those tools are great that we’re using, but they’re all selling the same thing. You can automate your sales and you’re going to have amazing resource. The truth is very different. You need to personalize your emails. You need to spend time on researching the people you want to reach out to just because in the end it’s about building relationships.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So I was like, “Can I build a tool that is much better in that sense?” And in 2018, we started Lemlist with $1,000 with my two co-founders. And here we are today crossing 10 million after three and a half years, so it’s been an exciting journey.

Itamar Shafir:

So I have to ask another question right now before we jump into how we help listeners. I’m sorry to everybody who’s listening. I’m just curious. That’s a huge jump to make with a thousand bucks. Now, what’s the secret sauce? What happened on the marketing side, the secret sauce that made that jump for you?

Guillaume Moubeche:

I think it’s a little bit of everything. So the first things is we ate our own dog food. We had built a tool to allow us to do self prospecting. So, that’s the only thing I was doing at first, running my own campaigns, using my tool and reaching out to people. But the way I was reaching out to people was not in a traditional way of doing sales, instead of trying to sell the product directly, I was really building relationships. And what does that mean is that instead of telling them what I was doing, I would reach out to talk about a specific topic. So I would reach out to head of sales, head of growth, head of marketing and explain that I was also a gross expert, that I had my agency before having my SAS business and that I was willing to share and exchange ideas with people about how exactly could they get a better process, get more sales and maybe that I would learn from them as well.

Guillaume Moubeche:

During this chat, I had actually two different scenarios. The first scenario was someone could actually be a fit in using Lemlist. They have never done outreach before and they’re willing to test or maybe they’ve done it, but it didn’t work in the past and they needed a bit guidance. So those would become potential customers. And the other one who could actually use one of our competitors, be really happy with the result they have. And for them, even though they would be happy with the result they have, I would ask them, “Okay, you’re using one of our competitors. It seems like that’s working really fine for you. What is the one or two things that you are really struggling with?” And they would come up with things like, well, my open rate is not that good, which is probably a deliverability issue.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Meaning number of females that get into the inbox or I don’t know, my reply rate is a bit low, which can be linked either to deliverability or to copyrighting, et cetera. And from there, I would just get to a lot of ideas of content that I could write about. Once I would get all these calls, so I would reach out to about 100 people every week in a neutral, personalized way, get about 20 to 25 meetings booked, and then I would just do that on a weekly basis and at the same time I would write content around the problems that the people I met told me about. So if you had an issue with deliverability and we had a chat about it, let’s say two weeks later, I would’ve written an article answering all your questions and I would share it with you, so that’s something that was really helpful because I could create the best content and at the same time it will bring value to people. So they could see that I actually care about them, which will ultimately lead to them following our journey and down the line becoming customers.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So the first step was really using our tool, documenting the things that we were doing. And after that, when we started to get some traction, because I was the only one doing customer support, I decided to launch a community. And in this community at first it was really to answer mostly support question, and after that I used it as a medium to basically share all the content that I was creating. I would share every single week the campaigns that I would write with the templates and the results that I would get explaining to people how I manage to book X meetings doing exactly this specific step by step. So people could actually project the result they could get by following my advice, I would position myself at the same time as also a leader and down the line, people would become customers and stay with us or get to higher activation rates. So, that was the get started recipe.

Itamar Shafir:

So you went the education route on the marketing side and taking that education, you managed to get people to of feel like you’re touching them specifically, you’re helping them specifically, actually bringing results, not just saying, “Hey, this is my list of features. You can do this, you can do A, B, C, D,” and that’s obviously worked very well for you. So for maybe listeners that don’t do this so much, even though most of our listeners are marketers, but I just want to make sure for those who are starting up, what is cold email reach out?

Guillaume Moubeche:

So essentially, cold email is whenever you reach out to someone who don’t know you. So it’s like they’ve never heard from you and you are reaching out to them and you’re trying to book a meeting. Usually we associate it with spam because a lot of people are doing this the wrong way. And what most people do when they understand how to find emails from people is just they go on LinkedIn, scrapes or extract the data of a lot of profiles, find their email address and just spam them. So sending the same message to the person and with just adding a personalized tag like the first name, and they call this personalization. Which is not right. The essence of cold email is about building relationship with people you don’t know. And for that you need personalization.

Itamar Shafir:

So let’s take it to an agency use case. Let’s say I’m an agency and I want to get more clients. What’s the best approach? Do I need to niche down to make it more personal?

Guillaume Moubeche:

The first step is okay who is your ICP. So really defining your ideal customer profile or persona, let’s say that you’re an agency for SMBs, let’s say any SMBs that is targeting HR. So it can be accountants or things like that. And what you’re going to do is basically niche down your targets, find all the people who are founders of SMBs that are targeting HR. And that way, whenever you reach out to them, you can have a very specific message that will resonate with their belief, what they’re doing and they would also see you as someone who actually made your research and that is interesting to meet. And the idea is to find okay, now I need to hook them, so make them interested about what I want to talk about. So how do I do that?

Guillaume Moubeche:

And the consultative approach is really good because it’s like positioning yourself as an expert and telling them that you’d love to share what you’ve learned by meeting, let’s say. And then you can name drop a few people you’ve what worked with or just say that you’ve been working in the industry for 20 years or X years or five years, and just saying that you discussed with a lot of business owner in the exact same space and that they were all facing more or less issues with problem one and that you’d love to discuss how they’d handle this specific pain point and also what advice you could give them based on what you’ve learned. And by doing this, it’s free, conservative approach and people are much more likely to answer than if you just say, “Hey, I’m an agency, I’m selling this service for you guys, buy it.” It doesn’t work.

Itamar Shafir:

I agree completely. And you call it the relationship approach and it is that. So on the technical side I know a lot of people are trying to email, they’re using different software, they’re doing different efforts and you have highs and lows of inboxing, and then you have an email that doesn’t inbox at all. Tell us a little bit what goes on behind that black mojo, how can we make it better?

Guillaume Moubeche:

So essentially there are a lot of factors that can impact your deliverability, meaning whether or not your email end up in their inbox. There are hundreds of factors. It’s a bit like SEO, as you said, it’s a black box, but the factors that have the most impact are essentially did you set up a proper ID card for your domain. So a domain has two things, a reputation and an ID. So the ID is basically to showcase that the domain is owned by a real person. To do this, you need to set up two things or three things, which are SPF and DKIM, you can see it as ID, and sometime demark, which will allow to really say there is a real human being behind this domain, this is not a spammer. Because spammer used to basically steal domain names and just send on your behalf in order to get a lot of information, credit card, et cetera, et cetera.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So by doing all these things of setting up these ID cards, you show to every single email service provider that you are a real human being. That’s the first step. Second step is your domain reputation. You can see that a bit as whenever you’re going to a nightclub, if you arrive and you are dressed with no t-shirt, your tie is on your face, et cetera, obviously the guy’s going to say, “This guy has a bad reputation.” You’re not going to get in. And the bouncer is going to make you bounce. That’s more or less the same thing with an email, if your domain reputation is not good, then inboxes will not get you in. And the reputation comes down to okay, has this guy been sending spam? Has he been personalizing his messages? Has he been blasting emails?

Guillaume Moubeche:

So you see a lot of people that are sending, let’s say hundreds of email at the same time, or thousands of female at the same time with their G Suite or Outlook or Exchange email accounts. All of this is the spamming behavior that will lower, overtime, your domain reputation. And the third thing is about the tracking part. So whenever you’re using a tool to send emails, whether it’s newsletter or cold emails, you have a tracking system that can be put in common between users. Which mean that this tracking system, for example, let’s say you’re using a Mailchimp to send newsletter, you are sharing a tracking with tens of thousands of people, which mean that if within these tens of thousands of people, there is someone doing some spam or really bad things, you and your domain will be actually penalized because of him.

Guillaume Moubeche:

It’s the same as if you’re walking down the streets and then there are tens of guys next to you start to, I don’t know, smash a window and break cars and then the police come and you’re in the middle of that, and you’re like, “Oh, shit, they’re going to arrest you as well.” It’s exactly the same thing. So the ID is for this tracking system to be yours. So how do you do that? You need to set up what we call a custom tracking domain, which will mean that all the opens, the clicks and everything, all the stats that you receive are actually tracked with your domain. It’s a little bit technical, but any developer or any person with a bit patient can set it up. It’s not really, really complicated, it’s not really rocket science, but all of this allow you to get a really good deliverability.

Guillaume Moubeche:

And on top of it, there is this thing of domain reputation comes also down to the age of your domain. So if your domain is really old, has been used and always had a good inbox rate, then eventually your reputation is much higher. And the thing is if your domain is brand new and no one knows about you and you start sending thousands of email directly, it’s not going to work because no one knows about you. It’s what the fuck? You’re just arriving and blasting, it doesn’t work, you don’t have a good reputation. So you need to slow down and start sending more and more emails, one step at a time and increasing that volume as you grow so your doing domain reputation build up. And this is the phase that we call the warmup.

Itamar Shafir:

So, that’s actually a great segue into Lemlist. You mentioned five points to help with inboxing. Let’s talk about a little bit of how Lemlist help with those points. I know some of them, I might not know all of them. So the warmup part, you have a special feature that you can talk about a little bit?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Yeah, absolutely. So this part for warmup is whenever you create your domain and you create an email account, what people used to do is send emails to their friends, then ask their friends to give them replies, et cetera. So it looks like a reading inbox and step by step you are able to send more and more emails, but the truth is we found out that that was stupid to do that manually. So we were like, “Okay, we have tens of thousands of users worldwide, we know the domain reputation of each of our users, so we can create automatically clusters, so groups of people, that are going to send messages to each other with unique sentences and wordings, and if, for example, one of our user send a message automatically, and we see that the message is spam, we’re going to put it back from the same spam folder, put it in the inbox, mark it as important so the reputation of each of our users will be boosted.

Itamar Shafir:

Awesome.

Guillaume Moubeche:

And what’s also really cool is that because we have such a variety of user all across the globe is we can have a lot of different factors to see what’s influencing or not the deliverability and make it that the more you use it, the better your deliverability gets over time.

Itamar Shafir:

And regarding the other points, how does Lemlist helps me with personalization? How does help Lemlist maybe help me with the creative aspect of inboxing? Because at the end of the day, if you don’t write well and you can’t articulate yourself in the way that people can respond to, you have some education around it, or is it more technical?

Guillaume Moubeche:

So the first thing is on the deliverability aspect, we have several things to help you get a better inbox rate and deliverability. First is a warmup, which is both a warmup and the deliverability booster. And then there is a sending algorithm. So we will never send emails at the same time. So the emails are spread out in a sending algorithm that basically allow you to maximize your deliverability. And then when it comes to personalization, we have framed the platform in a sense that at the end you can review what each email look like for each person. So you can actually spend a bit more time on each person to personalize and on top of it, because Lemlist doesn’t do only cold email, but it’s actually a multi-channel platform, you can actually be on LinkedIn, open our Chrome extension, type an ice breaker, so an intro sentence for the person you want to reach out, push that data directly to Lemlist, automatically we will find their email, send the message both on LinkedIn and on email, et cetera, to the person and create a sequence.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So the idea is really to build a flow for you to be able to automate your outreach and personalize it as much as possible, because the truth is to me personalization is key in your outreach, but there are things that can be automated because we are all busy in our inbox, but to follow up, when I see people putting in their calendar, I need to follow up with that person, I think it’s stupid. That should be automated. It’s like if you don’t have a reply, just send that follow up and put them in a sequence just until you get a reply, especially if you have spent time personalizing your message.

Itamar Shafir:

I know you guys work with small businesses, but you also work with larger teams. What happens when you have a team and you have a bunch of people trying to follow up and having different communications and you solve that issue? I’ll give you an example, give you a real example. It happened to us, it happens to us in our funnel. So we do Facebook advertising. We’re not special. And we generate leads, it goes through a funnel, through that funnel it goes into several things, you can book a time with our sales team and if you don’t book a time, there is a sequence that starts going out and then also there are issues that people do book, don’t show up, there are people that follow up, 50% don’t show up.

Itamar Shafir:

And in addition to that, you also have multichannel to follow up, which is, for example, sending text messages. Now the sales people, they also want to do their own personal follow up at the same time the automation follow is happening. So we have breakers that eject people from the funnel if an engagement starts, but then we have nothing to bring them back again. And at the same time you also have several people that might be working on the same person, for example, the SDR and the salesperson. Do you see yourself going into solving those things as well or are you staying in a different domain? Because when I use Lemlist, it was more for doing personal things. Business, but I mean not as a team.

Guillaume Moubeche:

It really depend on the use case, but one problem that we’re definitely solving here is you can’t have multiple person reaching out to the same. So you can’t have multiple teammates reaching out to the same person on Lemlist because we have this thing where we’re going to see in which sequence which person is. And basically if someone is already reaching out to that person, you would have a message telling you there is this other person reaching out to him, are you sure you want to get in touch with them? And by automatically we tend to remove duplicates and all these type of things. So you solve this issue, but the other issue of having someone in a sequence then pulled out, et cetera, and then you have to come in, since we don’t do any regarding ads and other funnels, for us it’s more about really pure B2B outbound, which is you find your leads on LinkedIn and then after that you just reach out to them and put them in these follow sequences.

Itamar Shafir:

Perfect. I do need a solution though. So maybe you can jot that down and maybe in a year or so, we can talk about it again, but I completely understand and appreciate the usefulness of doing things the way you describe it. I think that one of the key things that I found in Lemlist, it was also very convenient for me. And when I started, if I remember correctly, there wasn’t any ability to have phone calls. I read today that today you’re looking at it more the sales automation or sales engagement platform, more than just saying, “Hey, we’re an email marketing solution.” Can you talk a bit about how are you helping me close deals beyond the email reach out?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Yeah, absolutely. So at first what we’re doing is, again, eating our own dog food. So I was doing a lot of self prospecting on using cold email and then I wanted to start implementing things because I was posting a lot of content on LinkedIn, getting a huge traction on LinkedIn, and then I was like, “Okay, how can I manage to do both LinkedIn and email at the same time?” And then I started to test things and with my approach I was able to multiply by five the number of replies that I would get. So between three to five, depending on the campaigns. And I would be like, “Okay, multi-channel really works.”

Guillaume Moubeche:

And then I realized that okay, now that we have email and LinkedIn, we should also add for people the ability to do a call. So what I usually tell people to do is first warm up the person with LinkedIn and then email, and then at the very end of their sequence, have a test for the sales team to actually make a call. So right now, directly into Lemlist you can have everything in the same sequence so at the end you know exactly who you need to call because they haven’t replied to nor your LinkedIn message, nor your email. And then you maximize the person you’re reaching out to and you maximize the reply rates.

Itamar Shafir:

That’s awesome. And I love the fact every time that I ask you a question you say, “You know what? What I did is I started working on this this way.” And that’s super cool because if you get the sense that you have some sort of guide that walks in front of you going through the trenches, checking out what’s going well, and then saying, “Okay, I’m going to change my software a little bit to make it better for everybody, for myself and for everybody else.” Which goes again to your idea about creating a community, that I really appreciate. You started in email, you went to sales engagement, what’s on the horizon? What other features should we expect?

Guillaume Moubeche:

So we have a lot of things that we need to develop when it comes to user interface and UI that we’re working on. And at the same time we’ve been working for quite some time on a new AI. So I know that it takes a lot of time to go and start seeing each person, et cetera, et cetera. So we’ve been working on an AI that will allow you to help you write much better emails and come up with icebreakers, so intro lines, that would be, let’s say, the most optimized one that you could come up with.

Guillaume Moubeche:

And so far, the results are actually quite huge. If you want, I can actually read one outputs of an AI whenever, the input being my LinkedIn profile. So the AI just got the URL of my LinkedIn profile and here is what it shows: I just discovered your LinkedIn profile and I saw that you’re building Lemlist since 2018, it’s impressive to see how you’ve been able to accelerate growth and scale Lemlist without any funding. It must be very challenging to build a business, and I’m sure it takes a lot of confidence and ambition. [crosstalk 00:25:55] something that is [crosstalk 00:25:58].

Itamar Shafir:

I love it. So you’re basically telling me I can tell it to start writing emails for me and just go on vacation.

Guillaume Moubeche:

It’s quite impressive.

Itamar Shafir:

That’s where it’s going. If we’re talking not just about emails but this entire marketing AI based landscape three, four, five years from now, they’re getting into creatives, the AI are becoming creative. Once creative was people and automation was software, and now creative is software as well. Where do you see that going? Four or five years from now they’re going to be better than most copywriters, no?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Yeah. It’s very scary, to be honest. In a sense that I really feel like at first when I was checking how AI was working and even the results we were getting, I was not really impressed, but right now I’m like, “Holy shit, it’s not possible for me to say whether it’s an AI or a human being.” Really, for this type of thing it’s impossible right now. And in the coming years, as you said, I think… But I also think this is good in a sense that the repetitive tasks are going to be less repetitive, people are going to be able to focus on really this relationship part, which to me is the most important thing, which is the AI obviously going to be able to learn about a person, but at the same time you are going to be the one to know and have the knowledge for consultancy to build trust with the person and potentially help them grow. This is never going to leave. So, for me, it just puts the relationships even more at the hearts that’s everything else. And that’s, to me, the most important.

Itamar Shafir:

So now we talked about most of the features and the main important things that we need do for inboxing. Let’s build a very small campaign for our agencies from A to Z what we need to do. I’m going to give you an industry and you’re going to tackle that industry. Okay?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Let’s go.

Itamar Shafir:

And it’s a little bit of a difficult industry, but there are a lot of them, let’s say real estate agents. You know they need buyer leads, they need seller leads. That’s usually what they need. And you’re an agency and you’re starting your prospecting, you could start on LinkedIn and whatever you want, go ahead.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So the first things first is find, for example, all real agents on a real estate agent on LinkedIn, for example. Or I would get a list of website where I can find people working as a real estate agent. And then once I build my list, I would try to get as much information as possible on the person and on the location, because the truth with real estate agent is they work a lot with the location. So what you could do is try to split your lists into different type of locations so your message is even more relevant. So let’s say that, for example, I take the real estate in Tel Aviv, then I’m going to say, whenever I reach out to someone, I will say, “Hey, first name, love what you build with your company,” then you can try to find maybe one or two things you know about them that could be interesting.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Funny enough, I saw that your real estate agency is in Jaffa. It’s funny because I was there the other time and I was actually chatting with another guy in another area who has been really doing some crazy thing to get more leads as a real estate agent. They’ve implemented a lot of digital strategy and I’m not sure if this is something you are doing, but if it’s the case, I’d love for us to have a quick chat and see whether or not there are things we could extend and share. I love to talk to real estate agent and I’ve learned so much in the last five years that, for me, it’s always nice to catch up with newcomers and extend the best tips and ideas.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Would you be free 2PM on Thursday? So the idea here is just first step is intro line to catch the attention. So something that is linked to the person, the location, or their company, then it’s explaining what’s in it for them, what’s in it for them is that you position yourself as an expert. You use the location or the area to show your expertise saying that you’ve discussed a lot with a lot of real estate agent and that you know the best and the latest trends in digital acquisition. And then what’s in it for them, it’s free for you to have a chat and understand whether or not what they are doing and what’s working for them and to learn also from you new approach. So this is one approach that works really well, which is you position yourself as a thought leader and from there it’s working pretty well.

Itamar Shafir:

Is that on LinkedIn? I start that on LinkedIn?

Guillaume Moubeche:

You can start on LinkedIn. The way I would do it is find people on LinkedIn, but my sequence would be invite people first with a center connection request. Then you wait for three weeks. And after three weeks you start sending two emails. So one email and then a follow up. And then after that you start following up on LinkedIn and then another email, and then another LinkedIn message. Why wait three weeks at first? Because the ideal strategy combine both outreach and also content. So the idea is to create also content on LinkedIn showing, for example, if you’re an agency working only with real estate, then your post should always be on LinkedIn about real estate. So how can you find new things that are interesting for real estate agents?

Guillaume Moubeche:

For example, it can be tips for real estate agents. And then you list a couple of things on LinkedIn or posting about the latest news about real estate or how real estate is recovering from COVID or anything that can interest your target audience, post about it on LinkedIn, position yourself as a thought leader. So whenever you’ve added the person, they’re going to see your content during this three. So whenever you’re reaching out to them directly on LinkedIn they’re not called leads, they actually know you, and this is really powerful. So that’s, I would say, the more direct approach because it’s consultative, but there is another thing that you can do, especially as an agency owner, and I call it the interview approach. So you have two type of interview that you can do.

Guillaume Moubeche:

The one that we’re doing right now, which is more like podcasting, et cetera, or the one that is for articles. So let’s go back to real estate agent in Tel Aviv. And then I could reach out and I reach out to someone and I would say, “Hey, first name, I’m actually writing an article on the best real estate agent in Jaffa. I’ve talked with name one, name two, I’d love to have a chat with you. Would you be free? The idea is to discuss how real estate agents are digitalizing their strategy when it comes to acquiring leads, et cetera, and I’d love to get your insights on it.” And people will answer because most people love to talk about themselves. So for you, whenever you run this interview, you write notes, you understand what they’re doing exactly. So by understanding how they’re acquiring leads digitally, you know whether or not it’s a good fit for agency, then you can write down all the things that they’re doing, all the things they’re struggling with.

Guillaume Moubeche:

And from there you can also, at the same time, position yourself saying, “You know what? It’s funny. I was talking with this other guy the other day, he also has an agency. He’s doing things a bit differently where he is implementing XYZ. In any case, the article will be published in about a month, I’m just getting all the testimony, but in the meantime if you want to talk to someone from my team about this specific area that you’re not doing, just let me know. In any case, the article is on, it was really good chat, but is that something you would like to do? Because I know that it’s been working for a lot of people, just tell me.” So by doing that, you’ve built that relationship. You’ve got a lot of info about the person.

Guillaume Moubeche:

So you run it a bit as a discovery call. It’s a great way for you to create content, because you can record what the person are doing, you ask questions, et cetera. So you have an article ready and at the same time, this article allows you to qualify whether or not the person is a good lead. And from there, by doing this approach, you’re building your network because by interviewing people you’re putting them on a pedestal and everyone loves someone that helps you shine. It’s pretty cool. So for you it’s a really great way to build this relationship and establish yourself, while at the same time finding potential customers.

Itamar Shafir:

I love that tactic. By the way, we’re using that tactic all the time in our call center. A little bit different. We call it the PR revenue tactic. It’s a little bit different, but it’s pretty much the same article tactic. I love it. And I love the fact that you said, and I don’t think a lot of people know it, you went through it because you probably are doing this so much that you’re used to it, you said, “Hey, have a initial engagement, then disappear for three weeks, drop content so people would know you or get familiar with you before you do a direct approach.” And that’s critical.

Itamar Shafir:

Maybe guys if you’re listening, you don’t have the patience to do it, you just want to go ahead and start asking, work with me, work with me on day one, that won’t work, Guillaume has the exact right idea. I didn’t know specifically three weeks, but I think your your suggestion is excellent. So we build that funnel and I really appreciate that. And I think, correct me if I’m wrong, all the steps that you described, setting up the LinkedIn initial connection, doing the email sequence, following up with LinkedIn direct and doing the LinkedIn posts and reaching out via phone call, this all happens in Lemlist in one funnel, right?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Yeah, exactly. You can run everything with Lemlist.

Itamar Shafir:

Okay, perfect. So the last section that we have for the podcast is a rapid Q and A. The questions are in noway edgy, but feel free to say pass. If you feel any of them are too much for you. Although I’m sure they won’t be. It’s very easygoing questions.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Awesome.

Itamar Shafir:

Did you get along with your parents growing up?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Yes, pretty well apart when I was a teenager, when I was a bit rebellious, I would say.

Itamar Shafir:

That’s expected. Do you have siblings?

Guillaume Moubeche:

One big brother, yeah.

Itamar Shafir:

Do you have a pet?

Guillaume Moubeche:

No.

Itamar Shafir:

You’re too young for kids. We talked about that. When do you wake up?

Guillaume Moubeche:

When you mean?

Itamar Shafir:

Yeah, when.

Guillaume Moubeche:

What time? Around 08:00 AM.

Itamar Shafir:

When do you go to bed?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Midnight.

Itamar Shafir:

Ideal vacation?

Guillaume Moubeche:

I think somewhere in the middle of nature, far from internet and everything else.

Itamar Shafir:

Nice. Are you a man of faith?

Guillaume Moubeche:

I believe in something.

Itamar Shafir:

That’s enough. I think I understand what you’re saying. You’re not practicing in a specific religion, but you believe there is something more than you, right?

Guillaume Moubeche:

Exactly.

Itamar Shafir:

Okay. Awesome. Guillaume, thanks so much for being on the show. Your answers were excellent. I think you helped a lot of our listeners. And guys, check out Guillaume on LinkedIn. You can find them search for Guillaume on LinkedIn and also go and check out lemlist.com. Excellent tool. Thank you very much Guillaume.

Guillaume Moubeche:

Thanks a lot, Itamar. I really had a good time.

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